ELI ROTH: Hello, and welcome to the Death Wish director's commentary.
I am director Eli Roth,
and I'm joined by
the legendary producer extraordinaire, Mr. Roger Birnbaum.
BIRNBAUM: Nice to meet you. ROTH: Nice to meet you as well.
We actually met on this movie.
BIRNBAUM: I remember. It was one of the best moments of my life.
ROTH". We actually met and clicked
as if we'd kind of been doing a Borscht Belt routine for years.
BIRNBAUM: It is true. It's like we had been
friends since we were five years old.
And it continued through the entire making of this movie.
And even up until now, the day of the release.
ROTH: I know. Here we are.
We're actually recording this the day of the release,
which is pretty exciting.
So can you tell us how long Death Wish was with you as a project?
BIRNBAUM: When I was at MGM,
I had spoke to the production department
about developing a contemporary version of Death Wish,
and that probably started seven years ago.
And when I resigned my post at MGM,
one of the things I wanted to do more than anything
was to try to turn the Death Wish classic film
into something that could work for today's modern audiences.
I think it's very, very difficult to get audiences' attention today.
And so, branding has a lot to do with it.
But in regards to Death Wish, if you think about it,
Death Wish was made half a century ago.
- ROTH: I know. 40 years ago. Yeah. - Okay.
So there's a few people out there who had never saw it.
ROTH: Roger's made some of my favorite movies.
ls there a type of movie you're drawn to making?
BIRNBAUM: It's an interesting question.
As a studio executive, or as a producer running my own company,
I used to say to my staff,
"Look, I like movies. I like all kinds of movies.
"And I wanna make all kinds of movies.
"What I fear most is that if we make only one kind of movie,
"those are the only scripts that people will send us.
"And one day, I'll turn to you all and say,
"'How come we didn't get a look at that?¡§
And their response to me would be,
"Well, they didn't think we would like that."
- ROTH: Got it. - We like all kinds of movies.
And so, I have fun making all kinds of movies.
Get Dr. Kersey. Get Dr. Kersey now!
PA ANNOUNCER: Blue team to ICU, please.
Blue team to ICU.
NURSE: ...fixed and dilated.
(SLOW BEEPING)
NURSE RACHEL: Dr. Kersey, you're needed in Trauma One.
PAUL: Chris, switch with me. CHRIS: Got it.
PAUL: Thanks.
Gunshot wounds, including one to the neck.
- Vest? - Yep.
- Doc, please. - Hold on.
Thoracotomy tray now. Five units of O-neg, stat.
And five more en route to the ER.
-(RAPID BEEPING) - Get the OR ready.
- NURSE: Yes, doctor. -(BEEPING FLATLINES)
Let's call it.
Time of death, 12:24 a.m.
OFFICER McCORD: Got here in six minutes.
I couldn't go any faster.
It had nothing to do with you.
His heart stopped. He's lost too much blood.
We did everything we could.
Sorry for your loss.
Shooter's in Two, doc.
Sorry.
ROTH: This was certainly a challenge to make the movie.
Setting it in Chicago,
we got a lot of amazing cooperation from the Chicago Police Department.
And we worked with many ER surgeons,
kinda talkin' about them,
talkin' about the things they see, the violence they see.
Sort of the topic of setting violence... Although,
it really could be set in any city in America.
But we wanted to start off the movie with a big action scene that...
Sort of, you felt the chaos.
We wanted him to basically be
kind of the backstop for all the violence in the city,
the one who sees it firsthand.
And, you know, follow his journey from going to be
a life-saver to a life-taker.
BIRNBAUM: And I think he did a remarkable job
setting this movie in Chicago,
seeing that we worked with Bruce only one day in Chicago.
- ROTH: Yeah. - And this movie just says,
from the first moment of this movie to the last moment of this movie,
Chicago.
ROTH: Paul Kirby, our production designer,
was really terrific.
And we shot with one day with Bruce in Chicago,
that was all the stuff with him in the 'L' train and the exteriors,
and then we had a double with the car,
the BMW, driving through the city, and the helicopter shots.
And everything else we shot in Montreal,
which is actually a great experience.
This is a set that was built entirely by Paul Kirby,
and I thought it looked beautiful, just so natural and real.
BIRNBAUM: It's amazing. When we were just watching
the opening of the cops tearing down the street
trying to get to the hospital in time,
the interior of that car...
Although it's raining, and it's night, and it's Chicago,
-we were in a sound stage in Montreal. - ROTH: In Montreal.
And they were using this system called Olo Drive with rear screen projection.
It was amazing. I'd never seen anything quite like it.
Hey, I thought I heard a noise upstairs.
Did you hear anything?
Yeah, I thought I heard something, what was that?
Thank you. I got in. I got in! I got in!
(BOTH LAUGHING)
LUCY: So happy, honey.
- I'm so happy for you! - I'm gonna be living in New York City!
ROTH: Let's talk here about our young star Cami Morrone.
BIRNBAUM: She was a wonderful find for me, certainly.
Eli has known Cami for...
- ROTH: Number of years, yeah. -...a number of years.
And when we were casting,
I remember, you came in one day and you said,
"I know this young actress, she hasn't really done anything,
"but I think she's perfect for this."
- So I said, "Well, let's bring her in. " - ROTH: So confident.
- BIRNBAUM: So confident. - Just owned it.
Not trying, not forcing, and that's Cami.
I mean, she's incredible. I've known Cami and her mother, Lucila,
for a number of years.
And when we cast Bruce, we were very lucky to get Elisabeth Shue.
I mean, Elisabeth Shue is just one of my favorite actors.
She's so incredible.
And she's taking this part knowing
she's going to get killed off pretty soon,
and I said to her what's important
is that I want the audience to miss her the way Bruce does.
That Elisabeth has such a strong presence,
that when she's gone, you really miss her.
And then I thought, "My God, Cami would be perfect to be their daughter."
She actually had grown up with Bruce's daughters
and had met Bruce before.
And I remember, I read the scene with her while you shot it,
and she just had it.
She was just so natural. And you can really see it in the pizza scene,
where it's her and Bruce and Vincent D'Onofrio.
Not only is she not intimidated, she's so natural, she's so in it.
And she shot three movies since we wrapped Death Wish.
She's incredible. Incredible talent.
BIRNBAUM: I just remember, after that hour we spent in my office,
the three of us,
and she walked out, and we looked at each other, and we said,
-"That's the girl." -"That's the girl."
ROTH: And the thing is, look, you can be friends with people
and try to help them out, but, really, they have to carry it.
I'm certainly not gonna risk my reputation
on a huge film like this just to help a friend out,
but she was really fantastic.
Be me, and just shut the... (MOUTHING) Fuck up.
You think that's funny?
Say it again.
Come on, funny guy.
Say it again.
Now you're quiet, huh?
- Come on! Come on! - LUCY: Stop it!
- Stop it! Stop it! - Come here.
(CHUCKLES) Oh, that's right. Get your wife to defend you.
Pussy.
(LUCY SIGHS)
It's all right. All right.
Okay, so then the guy gets right in Dad's face, okay?
And he starts shoving him and it literally stops the game.
ROTH: Here's our introduction to Vincent D'Onofrio.
Vince is someone I absolutely love.
I've loved him since Full Metal Jacket.
And film geeks will know
this is like the mini Adventures In Babysitting reunion,
where Vince played the bad guy in that one.
BIRNBAUM: And I'd worked with him on The Magnificent Seven.
ROTH: That was actually Roger's idea to cast him, for Mag Seven.
BIRNBAUM: He's a tremendous actor,
an amazing professional.
He's very gifted.
And is very generous as an actor too.
ROTH". Yeah, he's an acting teacher.
So, like, if you look at him with Cami in this scene,
he was so good.
And they were so comfortable together.
The way she kinda jumps on to him, and puts him in a headlock, but...
You know, Vince is an acting teacher and an acting coach,
and really a mentor for a lot of young actors, so...
It was a very, very good vibe.
The other connection with Vince and Bruce is that
when Bruce was a bartender, famously, Vince was the bouncer.
So these guys go back to when they were 18, 19 years old.
They've known each other that long. And you get that sense.
I mean, they're trying to play brothers,
and obviously, they look different physically,
but really, there is such a healthy respect between the two of them
that they just had that natural...
BIRNBAUM: Do you think they look different?
I think they look identical twins.
ROTH". Interesting.
- FRANK: Cheers to Dr. Kersey. - Thank you.
How about two Kerseys that aren't doctors?
How about cheers to us?
ROTH: I like this- "The two Dr. Kerseys- "
We were sort of foreshadowing.
"Two Dr. Kerseys." Like, yes, there's gonna be a second one,
but actually, there will not be a second one,
Bruce will split. It's like the Jekyll and Hyde...
BIRNBAUM: What I remember about this moment here
is I'm recalling the restaurant
and how you and I went back there many times to eat afterwards.
ROTH: I have to say, there was a lot of pizza consumed on Death Wish.
I ate so much pizza on Death Wish,
so, after this, I went on the keto diet
'cause I had to drop about 30 pounds.
Because the food was so delicious in Montreal, you can't blame me.
BIRNBAUM: I haven't gotten that memo yet.
I need to get on that diet.
He's got the money. Not me.
Hey, thank you so much.
PAUL: NH.
Bulls fan?
ROTH: This was all Montreal, though we were shooting for Chicago.
This guy was terrific, who plays Miguel, the valet.
And we found out that this is a real thing.
You show up at a restaurant, your family's there,
they get your address, and then they text it to their crew
who breaks into the house.
And as soon as you leave and get the car,
the valet goes, "Okay, they're on their way home."
Luis Oliva, his name is. A really, really nice guy.
But this is one of those things we found out from the police.
"Like, how do break-ins happen?"
And I thought, "Yeah, that's it." They just take your car,
GPS, click the "Home" button,
take a photo, send it to their friend,
and then, as soon as you're there, they know.
Not all valets, of course.
(SIGHS)
Wow, you look nice.
So do you.
LUCY: Do you like your present?
Yes.
- Aw. - And I love you.
(CHUCKLES) Aw.
ROTH: Shout-out to my friend, Sophie Strauss,
who is a fantastic singer,
who generously gave us the song.
The song's actually called In The Freezer.
A beautiful little song that they're playing
just for a moment before he gets interrupted and called to work.
Yes, he's right here.
You guys ready?
PAUL: Hi, Susan.
I was just trying on my birthday present.
ROTH: I love this scene, you know?
This is sort of the last happy moment they have as a family.
He's...
Okay.
Mmm-hmm. Yeah, see you soon.
ROTH: Let's talk about Rogier Staffers, our DP.
You had worked with Rogier when you produced
- The Vow. - BIRNBAUM: The Vow, yeah.
ROTH". And I loved the lighting.
You know, The Vow has a lot of hospital scenes.
And they are very, very beautifully lit.
And we didn't want this movie to look gritty and grimy,
and I really wanted the film to have a very beautiful and polished look.
And we call Rogier "The Dutch Master."
And it's not easy to make these scenes,
to give them kind of an elegance and a beauty and a softness.
And I really, really love the work he did.
BIRNBAUM: He is a hard worker.
He is 24/7,
and he cared as much as anybody on this movie.
I was very, very impressed with him on The Vow.
I hoped it would be the same experience.
And, to tell you the truth, I think it was even deeper.
I think you and he really connected.
ROTH: Yeah, we just did a second film together.
But even just the way he did these shots.
I mean, just the way the car looks, and the van in the foreground.
I wanted to shoot it much more like thrillers that I love.
And this is tension.
This is where you know it's gonna happen.
We know the event is coming.
And just kind of keeping the three guys in the shadows.
In the first Death Wish, obviously they follow them
by taking the address from the groceries,
and in this one, they didn't follow them home,
they were just hoping to rob the house.
None of them want to be there.
So we thought it was interesting to play with the idea
that this all spirals out of control.
That Knox, the leader of this gang,
he's not some evil sadist, he's a professional.
And it's the character Joe, played by Ronnie Blevins,
that gets unprofessional with the daughter
and that's when it all kind of spirals out of control.
Honey, could you get me my iPad?
I think it's upstairs on the nightstand.
Sure.
Thank you.
Hi, Soph.
I can't hear you. (CONTINUES INDISTINCTLY)
ROTH: Love the shot here,
with Beau sitting behind there and just kinda turns his head.
BIRNBAUM: This is the moment that the movie gets dark.
ROTH". It gets very tense.
And you know it's coming, and it's a tense scene,
and they're very likable.
I mean, I wanted you to really like the wife and daughter,
so that you're upset when this happens to them.
And we should talk about Ludwig Gfiransson, our composer.
He's an amazing, amazing, amazing talent, this guy.
He's incredible. He's such an interesting guy.
It was our first time working together.
He had scored Creed for MGM.
And very highly recommended, and what a nice dude.
And we really wanted to give it a very unique sound.
Not really give Bruce Willis a theme,
but give him this kind of signature sound
that when he becomes the Reaper, and when he goes crazy.
I sort of called it the Inception gong.
This (IMITATES GONG) kind Of feeling.
And I just think what he did with the music
was so interesting and so sophisticated on so many levels.
It really gets you in this primal place.
But we wanted to have a score
that sounded very different from all of my other films.
It was a pleasure. But I loved the stings he put in here,
the instrumentation.
He conducted the orchestra.
Jordan? Can you please come down here? I need it.
BIRNBAUM: As we're looking at this scene, I remember,
it's such an upsetting scene to read.
But then, for these actors to portray it,
I remember how fragile they all became,
and how tense it was to live through this
even though they were just acting.
Sure you remember that.
It was very, very upsetting for everybody.
ROTH: It was, but I have to say, everybody was great.
I mean, with Elisabeth and Beau Knapp, who plays Knox,
and Ronnie Blevins, who plays Joe, and Jack Kesy, who plays Fish,
who's the one who's got the gun to Cami's head. And Cami...
We all went in there on a Saturday and we really, really rehearsed this.
Everybody wanted the scene to be great.
And we didn't have a lot of time to do it,
so we actually went in with Rogier,
and we went through the entire home invasion, start to finish,
going, "Okay, you would stand over here."
"What would you hear?" "Okay, if I have the gun here..."
And just working out that blocking with just ourselves.
It's not the kind of thing you can figure out the morning of.
And it's not the kind of thing, as a director,
you can figure out on your own, you really need the actors.
And the bad guys, they had to be memorable.
BIRNBAUM: Talk about these masks that you chose to put on.
ROTH: Yes. So with Mary Jane Fort, our costume designer...
We wanted a very creepy, but kind of iconic look.
I wanted to find something that hadn't been done before.
And I thought, "Okay, they can't just wear balaclavas and hide their faces."
So I said, "What if we printed a face on to a stocking?"
That way they're wearing a stocking, but you get these strange warped looks.
And that's what we did, and they wind up looking so unbelievably creepy.
But they're also practical at the same time.
I mean, these guys aren't aware they're in a movie.
I think Cami was really great here.
We wanted a look that would be disturbing and upsetting.
The idea was that they would wear this,
and if a security camera caught their face,
that no one will be able to pin them 'cause they have the masks blocking it.
That's nice. Thank you.
Where's the rope, girl?
Check the garage.
ROTH: I remember Jack and Ronnie and Cami shooting this scene.
It was upsetting, but everybody was really close.
We were all friends.
We all were certainly going out to dinner after and talking about it.
BIRNBAUM: Oh, yeah, they were great. ROTH: These actors, you go,
"Yes, you're acting, and no, it's not really happening."
But when you're looking at actors like Elisabeth and Cami,
and they want it to be real. I mean, look at her face.
They're really putting themselves into this position.
So, even if it's not happening, imagine if you spent all day
just over and over thinking about
the worst possible thing that could happen
to your family or loved ones.
You come out of that experience drained.
I mean, there's a lot of actors that sort of learn to
turn it on and turn it off and fake it.
But it's not easy. It's very draining.
And I'm really appreciative. They all went for it.
You look like you play sports.
JORDAN: No.
ROTH: And this was just so creepy, the way Ronnie did this little...
BIRNBAUM: I also remember that the two of them really bonded together.
They almost became mother and daughter
-when we were... Yeah. - ROTH: During the shoot.
Elisabeth was great. I mean, she started acting
when she was probably Cami's age,
about 19 or 20,
and has had such an amazing career,
from the commercial movies in the '80s to Leaving Las Vegas to television,
to everything she's done,
so she could really, really give good advice.
And she was very sweet. Right before the movie, they went out.
I mean, they sort of made every effort to bond as mother and daughter.
It was a pleasure. I loved working with Elisabeth.
It was just so much fun to work with someone at her level.
BIRNBAUM: And for her to be so kind to do this part for us, as you said.
ROTH: I didn't want it to be a thankless role.
I didn't want it to be like,
"You're in the movie, then you're shot in the head and you're done."
- BIRNBAUM: I thanked her. I thanked her. -(CHUCKLES) Yes.
We thanked her over and over.
Hey. Hey, what the fuck is your rush, bro?
ROTH". Jack Kesy was great.
He came in on audition and has this real amazing
kind of thug quality to him on camera.
But off-camera, just a very, very nice guy,
and easy and professional and...
What's great is, you know, Ronnie and Jack, with their stunt guys,
could really work out this whole scene.
How the slash would work. I like that Jordan gets up and fights.
BIRNBAUM: It's always surprising to me,
and I have obviously made a lot of movies,
but when you're working with the quote-unquote bad guy,
and how bad they are in the movie,
and then somebody says, "Cut," and you find the sweetest, funniest guys...
ROTH". it all comes out in the film.
Jordan, run!
Fuck it.
(GUNSHOTS)
ROTH: This was a decision we made, to show the shooting off-camera
so we don't know what happened, and we learn it with Paul.
And we talked about this. We had a terrific adviser
named Dr. Alan Azuelos,
who was on set with us,
and is actually in the movie.
You'll see him telling Bruce.
But he was our technical adviser...
That's Alan right there.
He's a real doctor. He's a real ER surgeon.
And every day... I mean, he would shoot with us
and then he would be like, "Yeah, I gotta go in to work."
And would go 36 hours without sleeping like it was nothing.
And I love this. Everyone just sort of subtly looking at him
like you know something's wrong.
Doc, hold up, man.
It's fine, it's fine.
ROTH: Mike Epps came in to do this part.
He wanted to do something different, something dramatic.
He was really great. He wants to do more dramatic movies
and we told him we had this part as a doctor, and he wanted to do it.
And he really clicked with Bruce. They did another movie together after.
But, you know, we wanted to show it being a Chicago hospital.
This girl Jodie was a real nurse.
Actually, almost everyone in the hospital
that you see are real nurses and doctors.
We wanted to surround Bruce and have all of this look and feel...
BIRNBAUM: I actually had a physical exam when I was there.
- ROTH: You did? - Yes.
- ROTH: But by a doctor? - It was from the craft service guy.
ROTH: Craft service guy. (CHUCKLES)
This is one of my favorite acting moments from Bruce.
No one else is gonna give you this.
I mean, the way he knew how to just look at her
and kinda roll up his head and have a tear go down at the same time.
I mean, I remember... There's no direction.
You just set up the camera and let him do his thing.
I think in one or two takes he got it and...
He said all he had to do was think about his kids and his wife.
It's not hard for him, that shot right there.
It's just enough. He knows what's under there, but he has to look.
It's hard. I mean, you don't wanna linger on it too long,
but you do wanna give him that moment.
PAUL". Our passports,
ROTH: Now we get our introduction to the detectives.
BIRNBAUM: The only other thing I wanted to say about it,
I thought you were remarkable in the way you made sure that
none of these emotional moments were melodramatic.
Very real. 'Cause when you slip into melodrama,
you can take an audience right out of it.
- ROTH: I know. - Good work.
- ROTH: Thank you. - Let's work together again.
ROTH: (CHUCKLES) I'd like t.
But I think that's the trick with a movie like this.
And the crying, and the director's job is...
Everyone has a different opinion of what is realistic crying,
and what is the overall tone of the movie. What are you going for?
And trying to make it natural and understated and not overdoing it,
that's what we tried to do.
I mean, he's a doctor, so he sees this every day.
So we're looking at the possibility.
You said string. How many in this string?
Uh, six...
BIRNBAUM: Now that we have these two terrific actors...
ROTH". Kimberly Elise is so cool.
I was so happy with Kimberly Elise and Dean Norris,
and they almost became like a comedy team.
There's some stuff we cut out of the movie of them
arguing over pizza and him being gluten-free, and it just...
We were veering too far into the Raines and Jackson movie
when we did that, so we pared it down.
But I love Kimberly.
It was very, very cool of her to do this part.
She was fantastic, and Dean Norris from Breaking Bad.
BIRNBAUM: And Dean actually looks like he could've been Bruce's brother.
ROTH: I know. It's so funny. I remember after we cast Dean,
I was like, "I love him." But Rog, you were like,
"No more bald guys in this movie."
-(BIRNBAUM CHUCKLES) - Because why isn't Dean Norris
playing Bruce Willis' brother?
Yes. We've all asked that question.
Dean always plays a cop.
He's always like, "I'm either a detective, a cop, a Fed, something."
But we're gonna get these guys.
Again, I'm... I'm deeply sorry for your loss.
- PAUL: Thank you. - Thanks for your time.
Dr. Kersey, your daughter's out of surgery.
SURGEON: Her surgery went well.
She's still in a coma, but she's stable.
ROTH: Let's talk about Adrien Morot, who was our makeup artist.
And you can see some of his work here.
Adrian's incredible. It was my first time working with him,
and we just had a blast.
His kills, the makeup,
the gore effects, were so unbelievably photo-real
right up close.
And all of this stuff, we had Alan there advising us,
"Okay, if you're shot... How could you survive a shot to the head?"
"Okay, if it hit you in the base of the skull,
"and it didn't pierce the brain, and you could take out the fragments,
"and evacuate the hematoma, you'd be in a coma."
I mean, we really talked through the steps of,
"All right, her raccoon eyes will be three days in.
"She'd have the tube in her mouth, but then they'd
"put the tracheotomy and have it in her throat."
All of these things.
BEN: When Lucy's mother passed,
she turned to me and said,
"Why did God take her so soon?"
ROTH: This was probably our second day of shooting.
Because we were shooting on October, 2016,
before the weather turned.
Turned out to be this beautiful day, this is playing for Texas,
and we got the great Len Cariou to do this part.
Theater fans will know him for really creating that role and winning the Tony,
I believe, for Sweeney Todd.
But he is a fantastic, fantastic actor.
BIRNBAUM: That was also a gift that we got him
to come and help us out on these few short scenes.
ROTH: This is one of those things where you're shooting a funeral scene...
How many times have we seen a funeral scene in movies?
And what is the essence of this scene,
is just, you know, you get a sense of a religious man
who, when tragedy happens, he says this is part of God's plan.
But this one, it makes you question everything.
"How is this part of anyone's plan? How is this supposed to happen?"
The father seeing something he was never meant to see.
He really just made it so powerful
and you feel the bond with him and Bruce.
With her mom.
One day, I'll join 'em.
There'll always be a place here for you.
ROTH: And then the movie takes this very weird turn,
where we are kind of in Bruce's position,
where the guy slams on the brakes,
and sees the poachers and pulls out the rifle.
Now, interestingly, this was one of those moments
that always gets a laugh when he grabs the rifle.
And I think that there's been so much tension up to this point
and no place to release it
that there's a feeling of watching your father-in-law grab the rifle,
that's a kind of nervous, uncomfortable laughter.
It's not silly laughter. It's like this release where people go,
"Oh, WOW! Oh, shit.
"Yeah, this guy has a truck and is on a ranch in Texas, and...
"He's gonna get him. He's gonna take out that rage."
POACHER: Oh, damn. Run!
ROTH: And this is some of my favorite photography from Rogier.
This was a very tough day.
We were racing to get this as the light was dropping.
BIRNBAUM: Yeah- I remember that.
ROTH: Kind of nerve-racking. You can see the sun's really going down.
BIRNBAUM: The gun jammed and it didn't fire.
ROTH". Just one of those things.
But then, you have Len Cariou, and he just gives this fantastic speech.
People rely on the police to keep them safe.
That's the problem.
The police only arrive
after the crime has taken place.
That's like...
Trapping the fox
as he's comm' out of the hen house.
If a man really wants to protect what's his...
ROTH: You can see Bruce is still very uncomfortable with this,
but he's clearly getting the message.
The implications are...
BIRNBAUM: But at this moment, he is still in shock and grief.
- ROTH: Of course. - While he hears
what his father-in-iaw is telling him, I don't think it resonates...
- No. Yeah. -...for him until later.
MANCOW: Thirteen dead. And this... It's getting worse.
The numbers are up.
You wonder how much more of this we can take.
RAINES: I'm sorry, Dr. Kersey, nothing yet.
ROTH: And now, we have the introduction of Mancow.
Mancow is a big Chicago radio personality.
AH the TV personalities that we have are actually Chicago reporters.
But Mancow, I've done his show before,
and I know he's a fan of Death Wish, and...
I wanted the film to feel authentic.
If this really happened in Chicago,
and this guy really went on this spree,
who would be talking about it?
It would be on the morning DJs.
That's why we have Mancow, Sway. I put it on Media Take Out.
I wanted it to feel... You really see what's happening.
This was actually in Montreal. We found this one corner...
This guy was really fantastic. Cleaner. Our window washer.
And here we are, back at Chicago North.
"...on the other hand, cannot be independent
"of positive economics.
"Any policy conclusion..."
Sophie.
- Hi. - Dr. Kersey, hi.
ROTH: Stephanie is playing Sophie.
- BIRNBAUM: Terrific actress. - She is fantastic. She was so good.
BIRNBAUM: We were just auditioning young actress after young actress,
and no one was quite right. And then, she came into the room.
- It always is that way. - ROTH: Always.
And we look at each other and go,
-"That's the girl. " - ROTH: "That's the girl. "
And what's great about her is that
you can take a simple scene like this and really, really make it memorable.
And they do say... You know that expression,
"There are no small parts, only small actors."
It's really true, because when you're a great actor,
you can take any part, you can take any moment,
and it becomes one of the most memorable things in the movie.
And just the image of this girl in a coma
and her friend there reading this, like, painful book about economics to her,
knowing nothing is getting through,
but I have to read it anyway, but this way she won't get behind.
This, kind of, teenage hope
that your friend will get better and recover from this.
We just thought it was a really, really beautiful scene.
BIRN BAUM: Not melodramatic. It's a testament to your direction.
ROTH: They were great. I mean, when you have really great actors,
you can just kinda sit back and let them do their thing.
So I sleep on the couch. I watch TV until I pass out.
Even then I...
I'm just not getting any sleep.
That's to be expected.
I can prescribe sleeping pills if it gets worse.
ROTH". The psychiatrist scene.
Wendy Crewson is a fantastic Canadian actress.
BIRNBAUM: She was in The Vow.
ROTH: This was again one of those parts where we thought,
"Okay, we have a really, really terrific actress.
"How do you not just have the generic psychiatrist scene?"
So, once we cast her, we need a follow-up where it's like,
"Wow, whatever you're doing, keep it up."
And she's so natural.
And that gets truly one of the biggest laughs.
Gets applause from people watching the movie.
So, for young actors out there,
never turn down a part because you think it's a small part,
because you never know what it's gonna be.
You never know what it's gonna lead to. You never know
if it's some other director's favorite moment in the movie.
PAUL: I wish I could say everything I see reminds me of Lucy.
But everything I see reminds me of them.
ROTH: This is one of my favorite sequences.
The piece of music that Ludwig wrote was so beautiful.
The montage of him trying to live his life.
You know, what do you do after this happens?
There he is. A piece of carpet's been cut out
and the floor has been cleaned where Elisabeth Shue was shot.
And this was from our first day of shooting in Chicago.
Down on the river. He's reading one of my favorite books.
Talking about dreams, waking up from dreams.
PAUL: I thank God for Jordan.
"And as they went on, hour after hour..."
ROTH: And then, this whole thing in the batting cages,
which is where he goes to let off steam.
Because after you've been through something like this,
they won't let you go back in to be a surgeon right away.
BIRNBAUM: But remember, we said, obviously, we need to have
some conversations between this...
How do we have conversations with our actors
-and still sell Chicago? - ROTH: Yeah.
BIRNBAUM: And we said, "Let's put it in a batting cage."
- Chicago people love baseball. - ROTH: Batting cage. Yeah.
- BIRNBAUM: Let's do it. - Riding the 'L' train,
batting cage, deep dish pizzas.
- Just enough of Chicago stuff. - BIRNBAUM: Yeah.
He's not going to see the musical Chicago, but...
Dean Georgaris' wife is from Chicago,
so he spent a lot of time there, so he really knew the city.
- Here you go, kid. - Thanks, man.
PAUL: No. It's not a
llE-ll
K-E-R-S-E-Y.
Right. Kersey.
MAN: Detective Raines isn't in.
Would you like to leave a message?
Yes.
ROTH: I love this sequence.
This is our first shot of the movie, actually. The first morning.
This whole thing was just a process that was gonna take time.
And that's the frustrating thing is when you have a family death.
This feeling of wanting to jump eight months later,
so you don't have to experience
the grief and the pain and force yourself...
It's this slow, painful realization that you're accepting what happened.
This is an exterior that we shot in Chicago.
And then, we went inside in Montreal.
And, again, Paul Kirby, our production designer,
his job is to make it look as natural as possible.
You know, not to overdo it, but we do try to fill the wall
with as much detail as possible.
And I loved it, all the sets, and then...
First, giving Dean this little thing of...
in the original Death Wish, Vincent Gardenia has that cold.
And I was like, "Okay, we're not gonna do the cold,
"but there's gotta be something he has to overcome
"over the course of the movie, as simple..."
And, at the time, I was very much thinking about going gluten-free
so I thought, "AH right, let's just give it to him."
I was trying to do it, I just couldn't.
And I since have, actually.
Since I had that little notification from my doctor
that I was dangerously overweight.
BIRNBAUM: Would you like a slice of pizza I have here?
ROTH: Yes. I think about it all the time.
But Dean is just so natural.
And what's great with Bruce and Dean is, they're such veterans,
and they're such terrific actors, and they were so relaxed.
It's just a pleasure when you shoot a scene like this
because you can just sit back and watch these two guys do their thing.
- Yeah. -(DOOR BUZZES)
What about the DNA in the blood and skin
from the guy that got burned?
We got that test back.
ROTH: Now this, I will say, is an exact replica of what we saw
at the Chicago police district.
They call them districts, not stations.
And these tags, the CCA, the Cleared Closed by Arrest,
and the open tags, those are the open homicides, open murder cases.
And we actually went into
a detective's office and I saw all of those,
and there was a little card on one of them and I thought,
"We have to put that in the movie."
Yep.
Most of these are gang-related.
Just asshole-on-asshole violence.
Some banger posts some shit on social media
and they retaliate with an AR-15.
(SCOFFS)
Last weekend, a guy shot up a party.
One guy shoots 14 people, no one sees anything.
They don't talk to the cops, that's why these stay open.
Point is, your wife's case is different.
You wanna have a seat?
PAUL: Thanks.
I mean, that's three burglars who panicked.
I guarantee at least one of 'em
is shittin' himself somewhere.
He's got a friend who's gonna get picked up
on something unrelated.
He's gonna sell his buddy down the river for his own freedom.
Okay?
I've seen guys turn in their own mother.
What if I offered some kind of reward?
We'll just get flooded with false leads.
Me and my partner are gonna have to
waste time tracking 'em down.
What about a private investigator?
Pl's good for cheating spouses, missing persons...
But murder case, they'll just take your money.
They can't get involved in a police investigation.
It's tampering with evidence, they could lose their license.
So there's nothing that I can do.
Is that what you're saying?
You can have faith.
How'd faith work out for them?
PA ANNOUNCER: This is Lake transfer to Orange...
Green, Purple, and Brown.
This is Red Line train to Howard.
ROTH". You can see how tired Bruce is.
It's probably 2:00 in the morning on our one day in Chicago.
And I loved using the 'L' train.
I mean, that was one of the nicest things
about getting to shoot in the city.
These guys were really, really terrific.
William and Enrique. They were our thugs.
We were originally gonna set this on the train.
And I remember, at the last minute,
they were like, "You can't shoot on the train."
They don't want any scene of a violent confrontation
or some girl being harassed on the Chicago train.
So we actually had to move it to this alley,
and now, I kinda love it.
We felt like we spent enough time on the 'L' train.
ROTH: I love these shots- They just kinda kick him and leave him
and train rolls by in the background.
And now, he starts thinking about protecting himself.
Jolly Roger's. Named after Roger Birnbaum,
'cause you're always so jolly.
- I dunno if you know that. - BIRNBAUM: Thank you for that.
ROTH: I love that, the pirate bear. Little nod to the bear.
So, that's Kirby Bliss Blanton,
one of my favorite, favorite actors.
And she was so funny and so lively.
And she's from Texas.
BETHANY". Ooh, and right now,
we have a special on our tactical furniture.
Surprise 'em.
Okay, here's a good one for you. Easy on the...
(ROCK MUSIC PLAYING ON RADIO)
No, no, hold it, son.
First gun?
Uh, yeah.
It can be pretty overwhelming at first.
I'll say.
Don't worry, I got your back. I'm Bethany.
- Hi. - Welcome to Jolly Roger's.
Come on back, let me show you around.
So over here we have all of our bladed weapons.
Behind me on this wall are all of our rifles.
Each one comes with a free case and two PMAGs.
And if you follow me over here,
all of our new pistols are over there.
And all of our used weapons are right here.
- Used? - Oh. (CHUCKLES)
ROTH: My job as the director is to tell the story from all sides.
You know, I didn't want a movie
that didn't look like we hadn't done our homework and wasn't researched.
PAUL: Forgive me for asking,
but what is the process for all of this? There must be a lot of paperwork, right?
Oh. (BLOWS RASPBERRY)
(CHUCKLES) Don't even worry.
We'll get you set up with your FOID application right here today.
State Police send it pretty quick.
And then you'll just have to take a gun safety class,
(WHISPERS) but don't worry, no one ever fails.
You can do that anytime within 30 days
of the time period you're waiting for your city permit.
And then it's just 72 hours,
and you're cocked, locked...
ROTH: So we're seeing Bruce kind of getting the idea
of wanting to go out and kill people.
But when she says, "All right, you got a gun safe.
"If someone steals that gun,
"those bullets can be traced right back to you."
This is a guy who does not want to be in the system.
And I'll come back.
Great, just ask for Bethany.
(SIRENS WAILING)
PA ANNOUNCER: Dr. Kersey, OR Two. Dr. Kersey, OR Two.
ROTH: E.J. Foerster. Shout-out to E.J.,
who shot a lot of our second-unit helicopter work.
Really, really beautiful.
But this is one of the things talking to Alan Azuelos in the ER,
this happens. And the doctors in Chicago that we spoke to.
When they're brought into the ambulance,
they'll often cut the clothes and check them for weapons.
But it slips through, it happens. Someone will have a gun
and when they lift them onto the table,
the gun falls out, so there he goes.
Now he's got his gun.
When I met with Bruce, I remember we talked about this,
we thought this guy can't know how to fire a gun.
So part of the fun of the movie is the audience watching him learn
how to fire a fun and be bad at it.
It's actually really enjoyable.
That's my friend Shawn Vance. Very, very, very funny guy.
And he put all these videos together. He did eight of them.
Full metal tactics.
And one of the greatest thrills I got to do
was doing this montage to AC/DC, which really...
And we put this song in the movie
and the audience just went nuts.
And you see that, stylistically, the movie changes,
'cause he's starting to change.
We're getting the split screen.
You're seeing bullets being taken out, bullets being put in.
This is the two Dr. Kerseys.
There's the one that's this life-saver and one that's a life-taker.
BIRNBAUM: While he's trying to learn about guns,
and how to shoot a gun,
he's not prepared for the psychological effects
that shooting a gun takes.
ROTH: Will have. Of course. No, he's not at all.
BIRNBAUM: It's a huge learning curve.
This is a doctor, he's a healer,
and he's been pushed to the limit
'cause people have ripped his family away from him.
ROTH: Yeah, and this is what pushes him to the breaking point.
I watched a lot of De Palma
when I was looking at the split screen.
And I just sort of forgot about how much I love split screen
and how effective it can be.
In a montage, and Mark Goldblatt,
amazing editor, we had a real fun time cutting this.
And then, this young girl named Olney Atwell,
who had done a lot of title design and graphic design,
came in and helped us do the split screen stuff.
She's really fantastic, but...
Doing the split screen, once we put it in,
there was just so much more information you could get.
PAUL: She's had a seizure.
Is she gonna be okay?
The only thing we know for sure
is her odds get less every day.
She's in handcuffs.
My daughter is in handcuffs.
And the men who did it are out there.
Free.
Look what these animals did to my baby.
ROTH: Now we see him becoming what will be known as the Grim Reaper.
And we should talk a little bit about the costume and the hoodie.
That really derived out of practicality more than anything.
I mean, we sat there with Bruce,
we tried him with, like, the hat
that Bronson wears in Death Wish ll, you know, a little beanie,
a skull cap.
If he puts a baseball hat on, it is for sure Bruce Willis.
You still see that it's Bruce Willis, does not hide his face at all.
And then we thought, what could he wear
where he would just blend into the crowd,
be very, very nondescript,
but that also would be kind of a signature thing?
And we came up with a hoodie.
And talking to the doctors about what happens to a lot of the clothes,
there's a laundry discard at the hospital.
We thought, "Okay, this is perfect."
He's not gonna wear his clothes every time he goes out killing.
But as he does it, he starts to get stuff from the laundry.
CARJACKER: Keys, now!
MAN: Whoa, whoa, whoa. Hold on, man. Come on, man.
-(WOMAN SHRIEKS) - CARJACKERI Give it up, bitch.
ROTH: Here is our first victims. The carjacking.
And they just fire at him right away.
And this is a common thing. It's often referred to as Beretta bite,
even though it's not a Beretta.
That's the slide on the Glock kicks back when you hold it too high
and it rips your hand open,
and is apparently incredibly painful. And we wanna show him making mistakes.
BIRNBAUM: But that's the first moment he crosses the line.
ROTH: Yeah.
(GRUNTING)
(GRUNTS)
(couemwe)
(GROANING)
(CRYING)
PAUL: It's okay, it's okay, get out of here. Go! Go!
(WHEEZING)
ROTH". This is where he shoots the guy,
and this is where the Grim Reaper takes over, you know.
Earlier in the film, we see him doing everything he can
to save someone's life, who's been shot,
to save the police officer.
And then, he's gonna save the other guy,
you know, the shooter. And then, here's a guy...
and he's now having the experience of sitting and watching someone die
and do nothing about it.
I mean, this is completely antithetical to everything this guy stands for.
All of his ethics have gone out the window.
You know, once he's kind of crossed this line and kills...
This was a Chicago shot as well. Look at the 'L' train going by.
(HORNS HONKING)
BIRNBAUM: All this stuff we shot with Bruce
was within an 18-hour period.
ROTH: It was tiring. But it was the only way to do it.
This shot I loved, getting him at the Wabash station,
just going up in the 'L' train.
It was a thrill, it was a pleasure for me
to get to shoot a real city movie.
I've shot stuff in other countries, I've shot around the world,
but I've never got to shoot in a major city like Chicago,
where you get all those iconic things
and the production value is just so incredible.
And now we see the psychological aftereffects.
You know, he's panicking, he cut his hand,
he's thinking about what he did.
Washing his clothes, trying to sleep,
taking the pills, having nightmares about it.
I mean, really... Looking on the news.
Nothing yet. Okay, he's safe.
Try to sleep.
And this is where his basement starts to become his little man cave.
You know, he can't really sleep in the bed.
BIRNBAUM: Because that's where... He shared it with his wife.
ROTH: Yeah, of course.
ROTH". Bruce is really fantastic in this.
We put in these little flashes
just to show what was racing through his head.
He just came out of nowhere.
ROTH: And here, we start to see the mythology of the Grim Reaper.
You know, this is the first couple he saves, and...
And they are just describing, you know,
this white guy with a hoodie. That was all anyone can kinda remember.
And we got a nice little rainstorm here.
This was not planned, but it's one of those things
that's just so cinematic and so beautiful.
Let's talk about Kaniehtiio Horn.
One of my favorite actresses.
She's so, so cool.
She's based out of Montreal,
and has this amazing kinda laid-back vibe.
Like the way she is in this scene is very much how she is.
But what a superb natural actor,
and such incredible presence.
And again, one of those people that can come in for one scene
and just do such a good job, like Kirby, like Len Cariou,
they just come in and they make it great,
and they make it so memorable.
Mmm-mmm.
So nothing that can help us?
It was dark. He was shooting.
Um...
BIRNBAUM: This got a great laugh, this scene.
ROTH: Yeah. It's like, "I'm getting hits like a motherfucker."
But this, we wanted to show what would happen.
I mean, everything now... First, it's a YouTube video.
And then, it's a story on Media Take Out.
And then, it's a meme.
And then, it's a joke.
I mean, this is how news travels.
Here we get the first clue that they pick up on,
which is that this guy has probably never fired a gun like this before.
Because, if you had, if you were a career criminal,
you would not make a mistake like that.
And this was a cool location.
Lot of neon that we used.
These colors. I mean, the way Rogier lit this,
I think, is so beautiful.
I didn't want it to look like typical cop movie stuff.
But this is where you have fun, get to use flashing lights.
I'm getting hits like a motherfucker.
Terrific.
(CHATTER ON RADIO)
Who wants gluten?
ROTH: God! But I remember this was freezing.
Montreal was not a warm city middle of the night when it was raining.
BIRNBAUM: When we first got there, we were wearing shorts.
- ROTH: Yeah. - And by the time we left,
-we were in parkas. - ROTH: It was a little bit cold.
So we had to shoot all this stuff first.
She's a real newscaster from Chicago.
So anyone from Chicago would know that.
And here he is, kinda googling and searching
"Dude goes Grim Reaper."
And I thought, "Yeah, this is how it would happen."
Someone would get the video, it'd go on Facebook.
Media Take Out would pick it up.
(CAR CRASHING)
ROTH: And this always gets a great response.
Bruce just laughing, and...
This is one of my favorite scenes of his,
'cause it's such subtle acting where he's basically, kind of,
slightly reacting, but you are watching yourself kill somebody,
hoping your face doesn't get shown,
realizing that you are in the clear,
and kind of enjoying it a little bit.
Like, is he smiling because he got away with it?
Or is he smiling because he liked it?
So now, we start to introduce Sway as well.
And, kind of, our DJs.
They're really like the Greek chorus of the movie.
They kind of speak the conscience of the audience.
We felt if you're gonna put a movie like this out there,
and you're gonna deal with the subject matter,
you have to really deal with it, you can't dance around it.
But then, just have people talking about it,
kind of saying what the audience is thinking.
We're not telling you how to think.
We're not saying, "This is right, this is wrong."
We want everyone to... These are the questions...
You know, it's a fantasy, this movie.
But it does raise these issues that you wanna think,
"Do you take the law into your own hands?"
"What do you do when the police are unable to help?"
He saw somebody about to get jacked,
and a black couple at that?
Power to the Grim Reaper.
ROTH". I loved Heather B and Sway here.
I thought their commentary was great.
And I love the idea of the police watching Sway on their laptops.
Just curious what he says.
He was kind of enjoying his take on it.
And Sway was so nice to participate in the movie. Really...
I think having Sway and Mancow and Heather and Tracy and DJ Wonder,
and everybody who has a voice in the film,
it just gives it such an authenticity and really grounds the movie.
You can see him hiding his left hand here.
This is one of my favorite little looks from Bruce.
We talk about the mask that he puts on.
And that maybe this is who he really is.
Or there's another side of him coming up that he's always kept buried.
And we allude to him having a violent past with a father.
That Bruce and Vince came from
a father that really pummeled both of them,
and that he used t ride the trains to avoid the father,
and that Vince was the guy that
really got affected by it and screwed up by it,
and Bruce was the one who got out of it.
BIRNBAUM: He pushed it down.
- He buried it. - ROTH: Yeah.
Buried it, but now it's rearing its ugly head
in a much worse way.
Let's take a look.
That must've hurt.
A LeBron fan?
ROTH". This kid was fantastic.
I remember it was his birthday that day.
This kid Isaiah was so terrific.
Really subtle.
But this is one of the ways he kinda bonds with the kids
is "Let's talk about sports a little bit"
and gets them to open up.
Still, LeBron might be the best ever.
- Maybe. - Yeah.
You got caught in some crossfire?
The Ice Cream Man done it.
The Ice Cream Man?
Can't walk to school if you don't work for him.
Selling ice cream?
ROTH: This is where Bruce now has a taste for it.
You know, before, it was just a carjacking,
wrong place at the wrong time.
But now he's thinking,
"What I couldn't do for my family, I can now do for other people."
And this is kinda what, you know, the audience is there to see, in a way.
They're there to watch him become the Grim Reaper.
And what is he gonna do, and...
It's like he's happy, 'cause he feels like...
This is someone who truly is completely suicidal at this point.
He doesn't care if he gets killed.
But he feels like he has a purpose, and...
We show the laundry discard. He's just getting generic clothes.
Using Chief Keef. We tried to use a lot of Chicago drill sounds.
Listened to a lot of drill music when I was making this.
You'll hear it later on in the club as well.
(LOVE SOSA BY CHIEF KEEF PLAYING)
- The cat, Tanisha. - Word?
ROTH: These guys are great. So this is shot in Montreal,
and Moe is the leader on the left.
They are so funny.
(WOMAN SHOUTING IN DISTANCE)
That was next level business she was doing.
- Pimp out your crib? - That's it.
That's what I'm talking about. Thank you.
Yeah, so, brought her up to my crib,
show him the picture...
ROTH: And I gotta say, Moe is such a cool dude.
We wanted to make him stylish, with the gold glasses, the white shirt,
and the Tippy Top ice cream.
It was just so perverse, the guy selling ice cream.
And he pulls out the gold gun.
We originally were going to do this in one take.
With just him approaching the street, the whole thing.
And then, we had the slow motion shots.
But I remember the first time we showed it to an audience,
it's such a moment of shock that he just does it in broad daylight.
And then, everyone burst out laughing when everyone runs to grab the drugs.
Like, they could give a shit that this guy is dead.
There's no loyalty. He's done.
Grab the drugs before the cops get here.
Originally, it was gonna be one shot that went right into this.
And I think that the other cuts helped.
This guy, Ken, he was really funny.
So you can start to see the police getting a little bit frustrated.
Yeah, exactly. White guy with a hoodie.
Fucking bullshit. Nine witnesses, one story.
The Grim Reaper.
ROTH: And he's starting to put together, like, "Who did this?"
And he sees the kid shooting...
The idea of the kid shooting left-handed.
That just starts to trigger something in Raines.
But this was one of those moments where you're like,
it was just the complete shock of him doing this.
That there was no preparation, that it's not
in the middle of the night, that he's not sneaking up.
It's literally just walking into the middle of a neighborhood,
broad daylight, shooting a drug dealer and walking away.
It's so completely shocking
that we wanted, really, just to show how completely far gone Bruce Willis is,
that, you know,
why would you do that unless you were just completely suicidal.
ROTH: Dean starts to see that the kids are imitating something.
Of course, tying in the left hand.
But... I love this. After... Now that he's killed someone
and gotten away with it, and realized he's good at it,
he can just sleep like a baby.
And my father is a doctor.
I remember talking to him about medical school, going,
"How could you slice someone up?
"How could you perform surgery?"
And he's saying that it's different when it's medical,
that there is a shut-off switch that you have to have as a surgeon,
where you're not emotionally affected by what you're seeing.
You're really treating it medically.
And I think that that's what we wanted with Dr. Kersey,
that the things that make him a good surgeon
are also what make him a good killer.
And here we start to see it spreading.
I love that little smile, when he gets mistaken for being 35 years old.
Just seeing everybody watching it on their phones, talking about it,
the mythology of the Grim Reaper.
The way I directed these scenes,
frankly, was, I just told Mancow and Sway,
"This is what happened yesterday.
"Now you guys talk about it the way you would."
And maybe someone takes the "pro" position,
maybe someone takes the "anti" position,
so you're not just all saying the same thing.
But is this right, is this wrong?
Like, make it feel as natural as possible.
And I wanted it shot on video,
I wanted it to look like you were watching it...
We the audience are watching it on YouTube.
It's not supposed to look and feel polished,
and I think it's one of the most effective things in the movie.
BIRNBAUM: It was a way for us to say, as filmmakers,
we were not endorsing the actions of Dr. Paul Kersey.
It's just something that happened,
and we're showing it.
And we wanted the people,
and in this particular case it was Mancow and Sway, to debate it.
We weren't making this movie to take a position.
ROTH: We were just telling the story. And, look, this actor, I should say,
is one of my favorites, Stephen McHattie.
He's so good at being evil.
But he, again, came in for this one part one day,
classic "gettin' your ass handed to you by the chief,"
and he was terrific. it was really, really fun working with him.
Detectives, get off your fucking asses!
He's pissed.
JACKSON: You wanna tell me where we're gonna start looking
for our white needle in the haystack?
Not where.
But when.
I mean, why now?
What, uh...
ROTH: We the audience,
it's fun to watch these two start to solve it as the noose tightens.
And then this scene,
it's such an example of a simple scene.
You don't need lots of music, you don't need special effects,
you just need context and two really good actors.
And Wendy and Bruce were so funny.
Bruce is smiling here, just like, "Yeah."
She's like, "Oh, you look better." "Yeah, I feel better."
The absurdity of a psychiatrist saying,
"Well, whatever you're doing, keep it up."
Takes time.
Well, whatever you're doing, keep it up.
(CHUCKLES) Okay. I will.
ROTH: Here he is back to training and he's, um...
Blows the sign up.
SURGEON: Give me the ultrasound machine.
Hold compressions. Give me the defib.
ROTH: And here's Alan, and this entire team,
they're all a real crew of nurses, they all work together.
And here we see Miguel Javier,
our valet from earlier.
So the audience will pick it up.
Bruce knows him from the restaurant.
Uh-oh. The watch.
I remember the first time we watched this with an audience,
everyone went, "Ooh!"
They all get it that this guy had something to do with the robbery. So...
One of the things I loved about the screenplay, about making him a doctor,
one of the things he can have be an advantage
is that he would see the bodies of criminals that are brought in.
And you can hear the sound that Ludwig does with the music.
That... (IMITATES GRIM MUSIC)
That's kind of the signature when he becomes the Reaper,
when the monster comes out.
Which is something that all of us have.
I mean, I think that everybody has a Jekyll and Hyde inside them.
And you have to have that ready and choose not to use it.
But it is something that I think people really relate to,
this kind of primal urge for revenge
and to hurt someone that has taken everything from you.
I love him going in and takes his watch back.
The one that was running slow.
And then sitting in his office, not being a doctor anymore,
just going through the photos.
And this is where he makes this moral choice.
Is he going to continue to ask the police for help,
or is he just gonna do this himself?
And he does, he calls him,
and as soon as he gets the voice-mail, he's like, "Fuck this."
BIRNBAUM: I think that's very important. He does call the police,
and they're just not there for him, so he decides,
"I've got some information here.
"I'm gonna go try to figure this out myself."
ROTH: Dorset Road. I grew up on the corner of Beacon and Dorset Road.
So, I always try to put little references like that.
FRANK: See you guys.
ROTH: And here we see the whole process just flashing back,
and seeing his own address in this guy's phone,
and then saying, "Yeah, I'm gonna call 'em."
But they're busy. There's a lot going on in the city,
And I also like that they show up later to personally make an effort
to let him know that they're on it. It's not that they don't care.
But I love this. This is where he gets this text,
and he sees it, that Trebol has something.
He's going through the guy's messages.
And this is a real place in Chicago,
in the Pilsen neighborhood, that we found.
And originally, this scene was not gonna take place
in the back of the liquor store.
It was the pawn shop.
And then we saw this location, and it was so authentic and so cool,
we thought, "Yeah, what if he goes in there..."
We're not there yet. This is one of my favorite scenes
with Vince and Bruce, and it's just...
As a director, it's so easy.
Really, what do you do? You just set up the frame and let them act.
And just make it about Bruce, kind of, hiding his hand.
And then, really, this moment
where Bruce has to say the most hurtful thing to his brother,
to keep him away, really to protect his brother.
He doesn't want Frank getting caught up in this,
'cause he knows Frank has a criminal past.
And, you know, that moment when he goes, "What is this? Is this about money?"
And you just see... It just
breaks your heart because Frank is so lovable,
and really trying to be a good guy, and trying to be there.
BIRNBAUM: He loves his brother. ROTH: He loves...
Yeah, both of them do.
And when Bruce says, "Do you need money?
"Do you want some help?"
He knows that's like the most horrible thing he can say to Frank.
It's really hitting him below the belt.
And you just see Vince is like...
He's almost out of words, and he's like, "No, actually, I was gonna pay you back.
"Here you go. "And then Paul feels like an absolute asshole about it,
but this is the cost. He's going down this dark path,
and he doesn't wanna take anyone with him.
It's all right.
- Frank. - FRAN K: Later, man.
PAUL: I'll see you.
ROTH: That was really one of my favorite scenes.
Just such an example of what happens
when you get, like, great actors and great casting,
is that, any scene like that in the wrong hands can feel melodramatic
or forced, but when you have two guys that have known each other since 18,
and they're both such superb actors,
it's really, really a pleasure.
So now, here he goes into Trebol Liquors and...
This is really fun. Ian Matthews, playing the guy back there,
and then, Trebol... You realize there's just something weird,
something off. So this is a real location in Chicago
and we just put up the beaded curtain.
And then this is our set. One of my favorite sets from Paul Kirby.
And, actually, in the back of that liquor store,
there was a room very similar to this.
We basically replicated it and then put that extension.
Hey, hey, buddy, you can't be back here.
I'm looking for Trebol.
Well, you found him, now you can get out.
Miguel sent me.
Who the fuck is Miguel?
He works as a valet at my restaurant.
He's got an MJ tattooed on his wrist.
He said you could help me find a gift for my wife.
ROTH: When Bruce goes in and he's trying to pretend
like he's there to buy some stolen goods,
like, he knows. Like, he was sent from the valet.
And clearly, this guy is not Trebol.
Like, there's something that doesn't really add up.
And I wanted to have that stand-off kind of a scene.
Like they do so well in so many of these movies,
where you have two people that are supposed to conduct business,
both of them have weapons, they're both lying to each other.
And this is where Ian Matthews, a terrific, terrific actor,
he looks and he realizes something's wrong.
He's about to do it and then he notices the Chicago North tag.
And that tips him off because this guy said he owned a restaurant,
and he's wearing this hoodie,
and now this guy is wearing a Chicago hospital...
And he knows in two seconds who this is.
He's like, "Okay, this is the doctor. We got him.
"I'm gonna keep him here, and let's take care of him."
So he's texting Fish, "Get over here."
The Fish is Jack Kesy's character.
We had lots of scales on him, and things tattooed,
but you don't really see it because he was kinda covered up
in a lot of the scenes.
So you're looking for something...
Specific?
Very specific.
ROTH: I love this. These two guys across the bar,
the way they did the neon signs,
the way Rogier lit this. This was one of my favorite scenes to shoot.
We could build this beautiful set just to trash it in a shootout.
Remember we talked about the pawnbroker,
-with the hand? - BIRNBAUM: Right.
ROTH: Through the receipts, like, "What's our pawnbroker moment?
"What can he do while this other guy grabs the gun?"
We thought, "Oh, he just grabs a dart."
He sees it in the mirror, grabs a dart, sticks it through his hand.
BIRNBAUM: And that always hurts. ROTH: Always hurts.
BIRNBAUMI Always hurts.
ROTH: Sticking your hand... The scene in the pawnbroker,
he jams it right through the receipts.
I remember we shot this on your birthday, Roger.
ROTH". Do you remember that?
Do you remember celebrating your birthday in Trebol Liquors?
BIRNBAUMI IdO, actually.
I was very disappointed in the size and shape of the cake.
-(ROTH CHUCKLES) - BIRNBAUM: But, uh---...
ROTH: We won't say the shape of the cake in the commentary.
I don't know the other guys. I told you!
- Shut up. Shut up. Shut up. -It's all here. It's all here.
ROTH: So now we see what's really going on.
And this was very cool. This was actually...
We could kinda build it off one of the loading docks
in the studio where we were shooting.
BIRNBAUM: But there's also something that's exciting that's happening here
because he's now on the path
of finding the people who actually did this to his family.
ROTH: Yeah. BIRNBAUM: And so there's
a different emotional lens that you're watching this...
ROTH: He's not just killing some bad guy.
This ls the bracelet. We feel like he's finally gotten through.
He's cracked it. He's finally onto the guys who're doing this.
I love the way this looks,
this stuff. And, of course, here comes the Fish,
while Ian is just stalling.
Ludwig's music is just beautiful here.
This shootout took forever. I mean, I remember thinking, like,
lining up the squibs and the explosions. I mean, it was like
a two-and-a-half-hour reset for stuff like this, so...
BIRNBAUM: Well, this is when I get the most anxious because...
How much time do we need to set this up again?
We have to get outta here by 9:00. But we had a great, great crew.
Fuck!
ROTH: Again, here's what goes wrong with the stovepipe.
This is what happens when you're shooting with a Glock stovepipe.
And you better know how to dislodge the bullet.
And here comes Fish, and, whoops, he slips in the blood.
I always love a good slip in the blood.
Never go wrong with that.
Fuck!
ROTH: This was fun to rehearse, and figure out smashing him.
And we can basically use anything in the room.
That's the temptation, just to be throwing televisions at each other.
But I wanted to show that Paul, he's intelligent about it.
He doesn't just run into the gunfire.
He realizes that he's got this guy trapped,
and now he has the benefit of the closed-circuit cameras,
and he just waits for the guy to be out of bullets,
gets him in the knee, watches, and then he's got him.
So you can see that he's learned a little something.
And you can see that Bruce has turned. He's not the sweet father anymore.
He knows this guy has information about who killed the wife.
And this is what you wanna see,
it's that primal revenge on the people that wronged you.
Jack was great in this scene.
And we set up a little bit of a Rube Goldberg contraption.
We start with the bowling on the television,
and there's the bowling ball in the background of Bruce.
I just wanted some crazy scene.
(CHUCKLES) And no matter what, the bowling ball killed him.
- Do you remember discussing that? - BIRNBAUM: Oh, yeah.
ROTH: I was like, "The bowling ball has to roll and kill this guy."
BIRNBAUM: But we kept saying he can't be good at this.
ROTH: And this guy would have another gun and would trick him,
and kick him, and the gun would fall down.
- Where's Joe? -It's in my phone.
It's got pictures, everything. I'll bring you to him.
ROTH: Oh... Dislodges the bowling ball.
I think that was the last shot of the movie, that bowling ball shot.
Stupid motherfuck.
ROTH: I love this shot. Hits him and... Boom.
BIRNBAUM: That also hurts.
MAN: (ON TV) Watch what I do in the next few seconds.
You might learn something
that could help you solve your problem.
- Grab this drill. -(DRILL WHIRRS)
I'm going to drill several holes
around this circle right here.
And when I do that,
the information that's inside of this metal box
will be a lot harder to access.
(DRILL WHIRRING)
With any luck, your metal box
should now look something like this.
(MAN CONTINUES SPEAKING INDISTINCTLY)
ROTH: This is how you get rid of a hard drive.
So now we see Bruce kind of in his workshop, drillin' away,
getting rid of all the evidence.
MAN: (ON TV) Stay out of trouble, you crazy kids.
ROTH: And then the next morning, just takin' out the trash,
wavin' to the neighbor.
"Good morning. No evidence in here."
(SIREN WAILING)
MANCOW: (IMITATES RECORD LOOPING) Reaper alert!
Reaper alert! Reaper alert!
WOMAN: (IMITATES RECORD LOOPING) Where's the Reaper?
ROTH: And now we have our third montage, where now there's the Reaper report.
Now we get into the memes.
We have Mancow and Sway, but now it's been
ratcheted up another level, now that there is another killing.
And this kid Austin is the local resident.
He was sort of our riff on...
Like, you always... Every time there is a crime,
there's always a local resident that becomes a viral video star.
But not too much, but he's just gotta be real.
And this kid Austin was very, very, very funny.
Yeah, there's memes. Like, people are making memes.
Look at this one right here.
TRACY G: Oh, that's too intense.
He's become a folk hero.
He's a real hero to these people.
They're being affected by all this crime in their neighborhood.
ROTH: We just wanted it to look exactly...
Like, you have to take a frame
from the video that was shot, create a meme out of it.
And we really had fun with going crazy with the split screen
and the quad screen.
As a filmmaker, you don't get to do that that often when you're making a film,
but just kinda gives you this feeling when it's all over
that this is happening everywhere,
and this is what everyone's talking about.
And loved the music that Ludwig did.
It really gave it kind of a nice pulse and a nice beat.
There he goes, right for the propofol, and he's stealing supplies.
And now that he's got his information,
he's going to get the next one,
he's getting his little doctor's kit ready,
-but, surprisingly... -(KNOCKING AT DOOR)
...here come the police.
And so, they come in and...
I remember this scene. This was really fun to shoot.
Bruce had to keep his hand down the whole time,
and the whole time I was like, "You have to act like..."
You know, he's acting like he's happy to see them,
but deep down he's just like, "Get the fuck out of my office."
But then when he realizes that they can trace the GPS,
that, kind of, great smiling...
"Oh, shit. They can follow the GPS right back to this hospital
"and will know that whoever killed that person is in this hospital,
"so, who would that lead to?"
I love Bruce. "No, I have never seen this guy,
"even though I just shot him last night."
Dean and Kimberly were great here. This was fun.
You know, one of those things we did on set was play music between takes.
It sort of drives the DP a little crazy.
BIRNBAUM: I remember that. ROTH: But I remember
putting on the music, Dean and Kimberly were just basically saying... (CHUCKLES)
Just put on music and we were dancing between takes.
It was really, really fun.
...before we had a chance to question him.
But we did find this ring at the crime scene.
That's my ring.
Yeah. That's what we thought.
ROTH: This is one of my favorite scenes of Bruce, where he just goes,
"That's my ring."
It was, like, kind of, almost indignant, like, "How dare they?"
-(BIRNBAUM CHUCKLES) - ROTH: "These people took my ring."
When he's actually like, "Oh, yeah, I left that at the crime scene."
I love his just, sort of, kind of poker face.
BIRNBAUM: Yeah. ROTH: It's great. It's great.
"Even the GPS. Ah, wonderful. Fantastic then." Little look.
I mean, there's something about Bruce that's so sympathetic.
And you've done several movies with Bruce.
BIRNBAUM: Right. But / go back with him
when I was the president of production at Fox.
- At that time were doing Die Hard 2. - ROTH: Die Hard 2.
BIRNBAUM: We go back a long time.
Thanks for your time.
Thank you.
ROTH: This is one of my favorite locations, this garage.
Waban, that is a village in Newton.
A little known fact, my brothers were arrested for break dancing in Waban,
so that's why we have Waban Brake Fluid.
They put out a hat.
(CHUCKLING) You should have seen the crime at Waban.
My parents were like, "Where's Adam and Gabe?"
It's like, "They're at the police station." We're like, "Why?"
It's like, "They were soliciting money." It was like, "They were break dancing."
That's so misguided and awesome,
so I, of course, put the nod of Waban Brake Fluid.
(ROCK MUSIC PLAYING OVER SPEAKERS)
Yo, we're closed, pal.
ROTH: Ronnie Gene Blevins, with the cut on his face.
BIRNBAUM: Right, this is signature Eli Roth, this scene.
Hey, fuckstick, I said we were closed.
EARNBAUM: That hurts. ROTH: That hurts.
The whole audience goes, "Oh!"
And this was one of the scenes we thought...
You know, I talked with Bruce, like,
"We don't want you just going in and shooting people."
And with Dean Georgaris, we said, "What would he really do?"
"Okay, you're a doctor,
"you have this medical knowledge,
"but you have this blue-collar side to you, what would you do?"
Okay, he'd know how to jack up a car...
BIRNBAUM: Well, he needs to get information from him also.
ROTH: Exactly. So how are you gonna get that information?
The oily rag.
And Ronnie Blevins... Ronnie is the sweetest guy,
and he'd just had a baby.
So he was, like, Face Timing with his wife and his baby. He's like,
"I gotta go, sweetie."
(CHUCKLES) And then we put him in the scene.
And he's just on the ground, squirming.
- I'm just gonna help you out. -(MUFFLED SHOUTING)
Trust me, I know where to cut.
Now right back here, don't move...
ROTH: This is a work of an'.
Look how real that looks. That is Adrien Morot,
our makeup effects artist.
Did this beautiful, beautiful leg and just the lining and fibers and...
Oh! Just spectacular. You really, really feel it.
But slicing into your sciatic nerve,
that was the idea. Our medical adviser told him,
he's like, "In medical school, they told you, pouring a caustic agent
"onto a nerve is the single most painful thing
"a human being can endure without going into cardiac arrest."
He doesn't want him going into cardiac arrest, it's no fun.
ROTH". But the way Rogier lit this,
and putting those fluorescent lights in the background...
It's funny because this is where the other Paul Kersey is there,
and it feels like you're in that Bruce Willis bad-guy action movie.
And he does it so naturally.
But, you know, I think, we're an hour and 15 minutes into the movie,
you've kinda earned it at this point.
And this is what we want to see, I mean,
it's kind of enjoyable to watch him get it.
In med school, we were taught that
this is the most painful experience
that a person can endure
without possibly going into cardiac arrest.
(SOBBING) Please stop. it hurts.
The bad news is
you've got a shit ton of brake fluid here.
So we might be here all night.
Now you're gonna start talking, aren't ya?
Knox! That's his name. Knox!
Knox. What's his full name?
I don't know anything else, man!
His name is Knox and he's from the South Side.
ROTH". He gets the information he needs.
And this was... We talked a lot about Death Wish ll.
Now, we can talk about Death Wish,
but Death Wish ll is where
Charles Bronson starts saying jokes as he kills people.
And he sees a guy with a cross,
Emil, from RoboCop,
and he's one of the guys that raped and killed his daughter.
Again, in the second one, he goes,
"Do you believe in Jesus?"
The guy goes, "Yeah." And he goes, "You're gonna meet him."
(IMITATES GUNSHOT) Blows him away.
BIRNBAUM: I remember.-- ROTH: "Do you believe in Jesus?"
BIRNBAUM: I said to you, "Whenever we have a bad moment,
"we're having a bad day,
"I just need you to give me one of those to make me laugh."
ROTH". Yeah, we were just laughing.
(GROANING) Fuck.
So you're not gonna kill me?
No.
Jackis.
ROTH: "Who is?" "No, Jack is." "What?"
Aah! Wabam!
Look at that gorgeous squash by Adrien Morot.
I remember, we put bananas, all sorts of brains...
BIRNBAUM: It's bananas and strawberries.
ROTH: And that was Adrien made this head of Ronnie in eight days,
this body of him that looked so damn photo-realistic,
right up close. I'd never seen anything like it.
The guy is a wizard.
You were a legitimate prospect.
What happened?
So you want my autograph?
We just wanna talk.
All right.
Have you heard of this Grim Reaper fellow
that people are talking about?
Yeah, yeah. I heard about it.
ROTH: I love this scene
where, you know, he's kinda lying,
he's kinda smug, and then
Dean and Kimberly realize that they're getting closer and closer.
But also where Vince realizes
that, "Oh, my God! It's my brother, the one doing this.
"Is this actually possible?"
"What streetwise lefty do I know?"
You know, the kind of guy that could
put word out he would pay for info.
Would want to execute our suspects.
A real do-it-himself kind of guy.
So you think I had something to do with it, huh?
Well, you should talk to my brother.
He'll tell you that I don't pay for shit.
Of course. So, do you mind if we see your hands?
(MAN AND WOMAN ARGUING)
- MAN: Hey! -(WOMAN SCREAMING)
ROTH: I wanted that moment of thinking that it was Paul for a second,
and that he got killed.
...a 49-year-old father of three was killed
while trying to commit vigilante justice.
ROTH: And seeing Jordan with a seizure and a coma, this is what happens.
This is what pushed him over the edge.
But hooked up to the brain monitor, your hands are in handcuffs.
And, you know, it's like Joe said, "This guy is gonna find you."
And now he's got his number, he knows exactly who he is,
and it's like, "Yeah, let's meet."
And there's something I always find fascinating,
which is, sort of, walking into certain death,
but having to know,
this compulsion to know, that just
all of your logic goes out, all sense of self-preservation.
I tried to do that in Hostel, where the guy is just...
He's like, he's got to know what happened to his friend,
even though he knows it's probably gonna get him killed.
He's like, "Yeah. You want me, come and meet me."
This guy, Knox, knows that this guy, he's daring him to go do it.
Paul sort of has no choice,
'cause if he doesn't go, it will kind of torture him
for the rest of his life.
Really, he's looking at his daughter,
and there she is in a coma,
so he's like, "It doesn't even matter at this point."
He's kind of given up all hope.
(LINE DISCONNECTS)
-(DOORBELL RINGS) - FRANK: Come on, Paul!
Paul, come on, man.
We gotta talk, Paul.
Hey, man.
ROTH: And this was one of my favorite scenes to shoot with Vince,
who's always a pleasure, but really,
this was what we called the one-hour-photo moment.
Where, I remember, we talked about where would he be living.
And he would put on the mask of the surgeon,
the facade above ground,
but below, which is kind of going into his subconscious,
if you want to be Freudian about it,
we turn on the lights and realize, "Oh, my God."
There's pizza boxes and food.
I mean, this is the reflection of what's actually going on in his brain.
He's completely deteriorated.
And now, after we've been in the garage,
we wanted to completely, completely change up the look,
and shot at this fantastic club in Montreal.
And this is like, kind of, the classic Bruce Willis in the hoodie
going through the neon sign,
and everyone dancing, and pretty girls around.
I wanted a completely different vibe for the film
because we've been getting kind of grimier, with the pawn shop,
really dirty in the garage.
And I wanted, kind of, this burst of life,
with all these people having fun.
-(HIP-HOP MUSIC PLAYING) -(INDISTINCT CHATTER)
ROTH: And so that was a real club location
and this is actually what the bathroom looks like.
We just replicated it, and then we destroyed it.
And this was a really, really fun, very difficult scene to shoot,
very tricky, where we kind of have to have everyone in there as a stunt person
'cause there's so much shit flying around,
but I'd never done a scene like this,
where you're just blasting away at each other.
And I kept thinking about the cops and what they said about people
that are in close quarters gunfire,
that there's such panic and such adrenaline
that most of the shots you miss.
And that girl with Knox, that's Naomi Frenette.
Naomi is actually a stunt girl.
Her father, Jean Frenette, is our stunt coordinator.
I love this guy, he's such a piece of shit.
(CHUCKLES) He used everybody as a human shield. He grabs a girl,
punches some guy, uses him.
Beau Knapp, man. What a terrific actor. He really gave this guy personality.
And Paul's only way out is to shoot the lights out, literally,
and crawls out. And that was Stuart, Bruce's stunt guy, doing that.
It was really, uh...
Really cool. It's fun to shoot scenes like that.
It's kind of chaos and screaming and running and dust and smoke.
I'd never gotten a chance to do a sequence like this,
something this big. I thought it really turned out great.
BIRNBAUM: And that was his first face-to-face confrontation
with Knox, the leader of the gang.
ROTH: We want so that he's hiding from the bullets
and he sort of gets a look at him,
but he doesn't get a good enough look at him
that he'd recognize him in the elevator.
But Knox certainly knows who he is, you get that sense.
Guy in a hoodie pulled out a gun,
then got shot himself. Ran out in the crowd.
RAINES: Hey. Alert all the local hospitals, all right?
Any gunshot wound being treated,
a male, 40s or 50s, give us a call!
ROTH: So now Bruce is getting to, kind of, this self-surgery moment.
He's gotta go and repair his shoulder.
Knox, meanwhile, is on his way to the hospital,
and is fully taking advantage of the situation
because he knows that he can bust Paul Kersey,
the Grim Reaper. He's not gonna say, "I'm the one who killed his wife."
He's like, "Yeah, this guy shot at me. He was wearing a hoodie."
He'll be best friends with the police.
The patient's this way.
ROTH: And I like this little reveal here,
where he's like, "Yeah, I got a good look at him. I can describe him."
I remember doing a take, and then,
Dean Norris goes, "What did he look like?"
He's like, "Have you seen Die Hard? Did he look like that guy?"
Dean was great. He was super-fun, deadpan.
And this is in his office, his little war room, doing self-surgery.
(GRUNTING SOFTLY)
(GROANING)
ROTH: Krazy Glue and duct tape were created for the battlefield.
It was to sew people up in emergency situations
until you can get them...
This is the stapler we set up in the montage.
This is the surgical stapler that doctors use now.
And he would know how to do it,
but... Yeah.
EARNBAUM: That hurts. ROTH: That hurts.
BIRNBAUM: That hurts. ROTH: Very painful.
Gluing your shoulder up, stapling it.
This is fun. I mean, this is the kind of stuff that I love doing in movies,
where it's just these little, little things that...
You cringe. Also, we're setting up that the cops are gonna get him. So...
The cops now are certain it's him.
It wasn't Frank, it is Paul.
They don't have the evidence,
but they're gonna bring him in for questioning.
And, of course, leading you up that he's here, but he is already gone.
We had a lot of cat-and-mouse stuff
of him, kind of, just around the corner, as they were leaving,
and then just missing him, and then just seeing him miss,
then running into other doctors.
But in the momentum of the film,
it just worked much better when they went in and didn't see him,
and then went right back to the house.
Paul, what you gonna do? Shoot me too?
What are you doing here?
What am I doing here? What are you doing here?
What is this, your little war room?
Don't you judge me!
I'm notjudging you! I'm worried about you!
You... You can't do this.
Paul, you're not a cop.
Then somebody has to do it!
ROTH: Here, we have really one of Bruce's best acting moments,
if not his best acting in the movie,
where he's just like,
"What the hell else am I supposed to do?"
And Vince is so fantastic.
And Vince is like, "I don't blame you." It's just like, "What are you doing?"
And there is that moment where he says,
you know, "I don't wanna have to bury you next to your wife."
But this is what the core of the movie is,
which you always talked about, like, "I tried to do the right thing."
BIRNBAUM: Exactly. I just think that Dr. Paul Kersey has been pushed.
He is not himself.
He's just been pushed because of all the circumstances in his life right now.
Solving the crime would ease his grief.
He's just pushed.
And it's just a wonderful moment when
you see his brother being protective and understanding of him,
and now trying to take control.
"I'm gonna save you if you're not gonna save yourself."
ROTH: It was great. And I remember showing it to test audiences,
they loved that. They loved the idea that Vince knows what his brother does,
and goes out and covers for him.
And the cops basically can't do anything without a warrant.
You're not just gonna arrest some surgeon
that's a pillar in the community, unless you really know it's him.
Like, you really have to have your proof.
BIRNBAUM: And we're not sure yet, but Dr. Paul Kersey and his brother,
they're the only family they have left right now,
'cause the likelihood is that his daughter is not gonna make it.
So the audience really responds to that bonding family moment.
ROTH: Yeah. BIRNBAUM: Taking care of each other.
But we're not arresting the surgeon
without an ironclad proof.
ROTH". And this is great.
When, you know, he's like, "I don't want you to be a part of this."
Like, "I'm already a part of it." And, "What are we gonna do?
"Can we check..." And then,
you know, he's gonna help him clean up,
he's gonna help him find the tags...
But just, basically, enough of this, no more.
And then, of course, they get the phone call out of nowhere
that Jordan is out of the coma.
And this is one of the things that does happen.
It's extremely rare when it happens,
but people do come out of comas unexpectedly.
And that was one of the things we talked about with the medical advisers
and our medical techs. How would you be out?
How long before they would call you?
What would that phone call be? Are you able to speak?
What could you even say? And we just knew that...
BIRNBAUM: And it's really important for the story
because it helps us understand the character.
Because when his daughter now comes out of the coma,
he is snapped out of that world that he was in.
ROTH: Well, that was the idea, is that they both come out of the coma.
That she wakes up, and he is snapped back into being a dad.
I love this scene. This is really a very, very difficult scene,
both for Bruce and Cami because Bruce has five daughters.
And they were very close, we were all very close at this point in the shoot.
And she just looks at him...
I remember, when we were rehearsing it,
both of them started crying.
And just when he looks at her,
and just says, "Dad, they won't tell me where Mom is.
"They won't tell me what happened to Mom,"
your heart just breaks because we, the audience,
for a long time, have lived with the grief. We've already processed it.
But now to watch the daughter
suddenly reprocess everything that we've already been through.
You know, you're thinking about it from that perspective,
it just breaks your heart.
(CRYING) Dad, they won't tell me where Mom is.
Dad, where is Mom?
ROTH: And I love the way Vince played this, like,
he's gonna see her, but he just needs to leave her be.
This is again one of my favorite scenes,
where Bruce has to come in and basically just be like,
"I just had to tell my daughter her mother's dead."
And he's going, "Okay, you gotta be there, but..."
I love the way he says, you know, "You, not this guy, not this thing, but you."
And you just kinda get the sense that whatever monster there was,
that other split side, Dr. Kersey is able to walk away.
BIRNBAUM: And at that moment, it's over for him.
He is done with it.
He's been, as you said... Nicely put, by the way...
That he comes out of his coma, too.
It's a miracle though, you know,
that we got her back. It's a miracle.
ROTH: The thing with a guy like Vince D'Onofrio
is that an actor can sell, kind of, anything with body language,
and he came up with it. He's like, "I would be curled up,
"facing away on the couch." And there's something about when you see him,
it instantly reads, it's like 4:00 in the morning,
he's been there for hours.
And the way he sits up, and just the way,
it's just so real and so relaxed, and...
This is one of those scenes. You just keep it simple, you know,
slow, push it on Bruce, just saying, "it's over. It's over."
And now, we've changed the lighting a little bit.
It's a new day, it's sunnier.
It's not the next day, time has passed, she's gotten better,
she can speak, and she doesn't wanna be sad and depressed.
She's happy to be going home.
We just thought, "God, give them a little bit of a moment of levity."
Until, of course, the cops are there.
And then we sort of see they're all lying to each other.
It's like, we know who you are, you know who I am,
but let's see if Jordan remembers anything.
It's okay, Dad. Um...
I wanna help you guys, I really do.
It's just that...
I don't remember anything
after going upstairs to get the iPad.
Any little detail you can remember...
ROTH: One of the things I love about Cami is that she's such a real girl.
I do find that,
certainly when you're playing high school kids and teenagers,
you really need a relatability, and this girl is just such a natural.
She's really, really terrific in these scenes,
which were not easy scenes to play.
And, of course, all of this is a set-up
for one of the creepiest scenes in the movie.
BIRNBAUM: Cami is an old soul. ROTH: Yeah.
BIRNBAUM: She just truly is an old soul.
For someone who is that young
to understand life the way she does,
-it's pretty remarkable. - ROTH: I know.
BIRNBAUM: She's bright, she's funny...
Thank you.
ROTH: We knew at the end, when they're in the home invasion,
you couldn't have a dialog scene with the bad guy.
But I remember the first time we showed this to the crowd, they were like,
"Oh!" He's in there, everyone oohs, and it's so creepy.
And this is Beau Knapp.
He's such a terrific actor,
and he really wanted to give this guy personality.
We didn't wanna just have some generic bad guy.
And it's become completely personal between him and Dr. Kersey.
And just the way he kinda clenches his jaw,
and awkwardly continues the conversation.
And Bruce is just, sort of, listening and like,
"Wait, what's this guy going on about?
"Why does he keep asking these questions?"
Oh, well...
I'm glad you're okay.
ROTH: And he's like, "I got shot." It's great. (LAUGHS)
Just the way he says thank you there, and then, "See you around, Dr. Kersey."
it's just very, very creepy-
And you know somethings weird, and as soon as that happens,
Paul realizes, "This is not over,
"and now that I know this guy's comin', I can do this the right way."
And, boom. There he is, back at Jolly Roger's.
And he's just like, "I want a gun."
And that's it, for home protection.
This time, he'll do all the paperwork,
'cause he's not goin' out in the streets hunting,
he's just keepin' it in his house for protection.
And this kinda stuff,
Mark Goldblatt is a big fan of the Dario Argento Giallo films,
so he tried to do a lot of Giallo stuff,
kind of the POV, Iookin' at the house.
I'm doing it online, just a couple hours a day.
So that way, I don't fall behind
when school starts next fall.
Well, that's smart.
You know, I think you're the smartest one in the family.
So how's your therapy coming?
'Cause you look like you're getting around better.
ROTH: We have Elisabeth Shue's photo in the background.
And I think one of the things people like about the movie is,
he basically lives for his daughter, and to kill for his wife.
And there's something about that that's very noble, very honorable,
that people really respond to.
It's all about trying to avenge his family.
BIRNBAUM: Right. And he obviously feels,
still, somewhat guilty that he wasn't there to protect them the first time.
He's going to protect her now, forever.
ROTH: So now the fun is that Knox has brought some company,
some professionals,
and they're not playin' around,
and this is it, they're gonna take care of them.
But this is where we get to see
the skills that Paul Kersey has acquired.
How are you gonna defend yourself when three people break into your house?
And that was the fun. How's it all gonna be different? So...
This is a classic, like, Giallo horror movie shot.
This is where I love to put horror movie tropes and things
in action revenge thrillers.
BIRNBAUM: And it's poetic. It started in this house,
-and it's gonna end here. - ROTH: Yeah.
All in the house. And again,
Paul Kirby, our production designer was so fantastic,
and the whole art department.
Claire, Vidar, who did our props and on-set dressing,
everyone was really, really into it and the details of making it feel real.
And we came up with this idea that he would, you know...
Where would you hide her?
It's like, he hides her under the stairs.
We don't know, just what else is he gonna do? Just call 911,
so the cops are on the way.
And then Dad will take care of the rest.
(BREATHING HEAVILY)
-(DIALING) -(LINE RINGING)
DISPATCHER: 911, what is your emergency?
There's men, they're breaking into my house.
ROTH". I love this performance, too.
My name is Jordan Kersey.
ROTH: And then, so we don't know what's gonna happen,
we're just gonna cut to the POV of the killers, and...
This is my favorite kind of filming,
when you can just... There's no dialog, it's just the camera moving.
Just simple storytelling.
Leaving the tension, the little... Of course, we're setting up the table,
which we're gonna pay off later.
BIRNBAUM: We know what's coming. ROTH: We know what's coming.
You just tease it. Okay, first it's the knife.
Then, uh-oh, these guys have, like, serious firepower, and then,
they're right on top of you on the stairs.
It was a lot of fun. This is Jean Frenette, our stunt coordinator.
And with Rogier, we spent a long time,
kind of, working out both the home invasion,
and then the second home invasion.
And how's he gonna get him? Because we, the audience, have to
really be surprised along...
We're all rooting for Paul,
but you're thinking, "Okay, there's no way he's gonna beat these guys."
And so, tearing up the bedroom,
but, of course, he decoyed her.
(GASPS)
(SHOWER RUNNING)
ROTH: And this was great. Kind of misleading him in the shower,
-and then, boom. - BIRNBAUM: That hurts.
ROTH: That definitely hurts. BIRNBAUM: That hurts.
ROTH". But then we thought...
I love the other guy sees his friend on the ground,
just unsuspected, but then, under the bed... Boom!
And this is an Adrien Morot special.
Watch this body just crunch.
(LAUGHING) It's just the way the head flattens.
The audience jumps three feet out of their seat.
BIRNBAUM: It's on the bone. ROTH: Everybody loves it.
You said no more bald guys,
but I just put one bald guy as long as I crush his head.
It's just something very upsetting about seeing a head shaped that way,
smashed in.
But that was Adrien. He made this dummy that was so realistic,
we could drop it 50 times until we got the perfect crunch.
And I think We did.
(METAL CLATTERS)
ROTH: And now Knox is kind of trapping him in the basement.
But, of course, Bruce is walking his way
very carefully over to his hidden gun.
And I love this. This is the unfinished part of the house.
And he's misleading him into thinking that maybe this guy is behind the couch.
Where is he hiding?
And it was fun shooting with Bruce and Beau. They're really, really terrific.
And Beau is awesome.
He's really, really a fantastic actor.
-(GROANS) - Sit down.
Dad?
I think they just shot my dad.
Dad! Dad!
ROTH: And we thought what else would he say?
It's like, "Oh, here's the daughter coming out." He's like,
"Did you ever hear of someone burn to death?
"Oh, you're in for a treat." You think, "Oh, great.
"He's gonna, like, tie them up and light them on fire."
Just like, as if this guy wasn't horrible enough,
he looks away for one second and boom.
Surprise him.
(SIRENS WAILING)
ROTH: This is that great scene that everyone remembers
from Vincent Gardenia and Bronson in the first one.
The two kind of come to an understanding that this is over.
BIRNBAUM: And I'm not gonna take you in, and you're gonna stop this.
And the paperwork for the pistols and the rifle?
You can call Jolly Roger's Sporting Goods.
Ask for Bethany.
ROTH: And I love the way he says, "Dr. Kersey,
"just stick to saving lives. You're good at it."
It's good. And this is great. This is Dean worried about a Glock.
It's the way he says this line, it's really, really fantastic.
Bruce just kinda lying to him, like, "Yeah, I know you know.
"You know I know. Let's not pretend anymore."
And there's a great moment. It's almost like a laugh, when he goes,
"Well, I got everything I need." Like, "All right."
-(LAUGHS) The audience... - BIRNBAUM: The audience loves that.
ROTH". They love that moment
when they realize that Raines is gonna let him off the hook.
And they're like, "Yeah. I know. I know why you did this.
"I know you're going after these people.
"Just, like, let's all just stop this now, please."
But, as we see the end of the film,
once you open Pandora's box,
there ain't no puttin' it back in.
This is our last, sort of, moment where you finally see the family together.
Again, this is one of the last things we shot.
I feel like this was Bruce's last day of shooting, so...
it's weird, the end of the movie I associate with the end of shooting.
BIRNBAUM: And then we all went home for Christmas.
ROTH: We did. Oh, look. Finally, we get to pay off the gluten. (CHUCKLES)
So stupid. He wants pizza.
Give him a slice of pizza. You earned it.
Now he'S happy-
And then we have our little coda in New York City with Sway, you know.
Time has passed.
Jordan is off at school, and we see her, she's with Sophie.
And we just got very lucky that this was a beautiful day.
I love the way this scene turned out, the way the sun was shining.
This beautiful fall light really felt like...
I went to NYU. This is what it felt like.
You know, the parents droppin' the kids off,
and everyone just like, "Okay, you can go now."
But we see Jordan is back to normal, and she's with Sophie,
and everything seems fine, and they've moved on.
Or have they?
BIRNBAUM: Can I multiple-choice answer?
All right. Go be smart.
Bye, baby.
ROTH: Stephanie, for that one little moment.
BIRNBAUM: I remember us looking at this, at this moment,
that girl is a movie star.
ROTH: Yeah, for sure.
Yeah, that's like the movie-star shots of Cami.
And then this is our...
Of course, we have to do the nod to Bronson. The guy grabbin' the suitcase.
And we had a big talk about how to end the movie.
And we just looked at the end of the first one,
with just him doing the finger-gun.
Cut to Back in Black.
And very cool,
Mutt Lange and AC/DC lettin' us use this song.
Then we go right into the titles.
You know, I didn't wanna do a long title sequence.
It just says Death Wish at the beginning of the film.
I mean, everybody knows what it is. I just kinda wanted us to...
Roger Birnbaum! P.G.A.
BIRNBAUM: Why did you spell my name incorrectly there now.
- ROTH: Just to see if you'd notice. -(BIRNBAUM CHUCKLES)
ROTH: And, yeah, this was a... I love the...
Rogier did such a great job.
You know, these titles using the EKG,
kind of, killing the title and flatlining it halfway through.
BIRNBAUM: This is nice for me
because I haven't seen the picture for a while, and now I'm remembering,
very specifically, all these great people who...
ROTH: Oh, Mark Goldblatt, amazing job as our editor.
Just the nicest guy, and he's cut so many of my favorite films.
It was such an honor to work with him.
(BACK IN BLACK BY AC/DC PLAYING)
ROTH: Mary Vernieu and Marisol did a terrific job casting.
And Ludwig with the music.
I love AC/DC so much.
Getting to use Back in Black in a movie
was one of the great thrills of my career.
Both to cut it to the split-screen montage, and to put it in the film.
- Now, Roger Birnbaum. - BIRNBAUM: Yes.
ROTH: Some people out here,
listening to this commentary, if they're this far,
wanna be directors, they wanna be producers, they wanna be writers.
ls there one piece of consistent advice...
Say they're in Ohio, they've no connections,
they have dreams of giving it up and coming to California.
ls there any one consistent piece of advice that you'd impart...
'Cause I know you teach as well...
To any young aspiring writer, directors or producers out there?
BIRNBAUM: What I would say, and which I have said many times,
is just get in the game.
Take any job that is offered.
If it's getting coffee, get the coffee.
And when you get that coffee, deliver it hot.
And be respectful and be loyal,
and keep your eyes and ears open, and learn.
And the next time, somebody will hire you from that crew,
and they'll give you something else to do,
not just getting coffee.
From another point of view, I usually say to students when I'm teaching,
you gotta have a point of view if you're gonna be in this business.
If you don't have a point of view, don't bother.
There's a lot of people who wanna do this.
And everybody who's gonna succeed has a point of view.
But then on top of that,
you have to be able to articulate that point of view.
If you can't sell it,
it doesn't matter if you have a point of view.
And you don't have to be special to have a point of view
or to be able to articulate.
You have to believe in yourself and you have to believe in your ideas.
You know, when I came to California,
a few short years ago, I didn't know anybody.
ROTH: And you came out from New York, New Jersey.
BIRNBAUM: Right. And I never even thought about being in this business.
And years later,
you know, I end up being the chairman of MGM.
It's not because I had a special talent.
It's 'cause I cared about what I did,
and I believed in the ideas,
and I never abandoned my average way of approaching stories.
I always thought, you know, if I like that story, a lot of other people...
I'm not trying to trick audiences into falling in love with the story,
I try to go with what I think they will also like.
Don't follow trends is another piece of advice.
You follow a trend,
you're gonna be behind by the time...
ROTH: Yeah, by the time your movie comes out.
BIRNBAUM: We had such a good time,
and we have such great respect for each other,
-we're gonna do this again. - ROTH: We're doing it again.
Birnbaum and Roth, back in action.
So this will not be the last commentary you hear from the two of us.
We're not yet saying what our next production is.
I have to thank you, Roger, because I've never quite had an experience like this.
This was a challenge to make the movie, on many levels,
and we never could have done it without your support.
It was like a great, great team,
and we always try to approach it from a smart way.
- BIRNBAUM: We also had fun. - We had fun.
BIRNBAUM: Everybody who wants to be making movies,
it's tough to get there, and making movies is hard.
Even when you're making the movie, it's hard.
But if you can stop every now and again
and pinch yourself, and say,
"I'm doing what I've always wanted to do."
Enjoy the moment.
And I think we both reminded each other of that all the time.
And we had a blast making this movie.
ROTH: Yes, we did. Thank you for listening, everybody.
You can hit me up on social @eliroth, Twitter,
@realeliroth, lnstagram,
and Ell Roth, Facebook, and I'll relay your tweets to Roger,
'cause he doesn't do any of that stuff.
- Thanks. -(BIRNBAUM CHUCKLES)